Great podcast. These story’s need to be told, so I thank you guys for your amazing work! Also for those one star reviews, you are entitled to your opinions, and this show is not perfect but it is still helping with the healing of the abused. And also I don’t see any of you making podcasts or helping in any way. And the fact that you are labeling this podcast as gossip, is just proving the point of this podcast. And until you guys do something about it, and start to understand it, I don’t think you can really judge this podcast. And a lot of times people and churches just notice the bad parts and don’t care about the good parts. And also a lot of you who are reviewing, have never really been spiritually abused. I personally have been through four different churches and I am only 15 years old. And this podcast has really helped me. Thank you for this podcast jay and Johna! Keep up the good work. Also for the people who say that you need to do all sides of the story. Having the abuser with the abused is traumatizing. And also the whole point is that the abuser twists the story to where it is the person who was abused fault. And also this podcast is to help the abused. They do care about the abusers to because there mental health is probably not that good. But I would bet that if the abuser were to reach out to them to tell them their story they would listen to it. They might not make an episode about it because that would be hard for the one that was abused, but they would probably help with the abusers healing to if they can. And for all those people who do not listen to me because I am fifteen, just because I am fifteen does not mean that I do not know about abuse.

Tremendously discouraged as a believer, as I just listened to an interview that hosted blatant lies that stir quarrelsome and hateful conversation. I am saddened by the lack of research and study that would appear to be done. Just very disturbed by this as a Christian who believes that Christians should not foster lies that stir up controversy.

I have been listening to a few deconstruction podcasts over the past few years and Bodies Behind The Bus has really helped me expand my views on issues from the Israel Palestine war to how many evangelical churches handle abuse scandals. I appreciate listening to this podcast and want to say thank you to the hosts and board who make this possible! Thank you

I just found you and have gobbled up every episode. I feel seen and heard in every story and want to have a big party with every guest and the compassionate, lovely co-hosts. I feel like we are all friends even though we have never actually met. Bravo for this good, hard work!!

Nicole’s story from 2-2-22 brought me to tears. I have had that experience with a church and I just had it again in my non-ministry job. It was so affirming to have her perspective that I’m not crazy- that the gaslighting was real, and that I matter even when others try to make me extremely small. Thank you for sharing your stories.

Needed voices of survivors right here. Our stories are powerful seeds cast out and growing a garden of healing and hope. I feel seen. I know how to rise now, move forward, and confidently keep sowing the seeds of my own story of hit-and-run.

and whether you’re deconstructing or reformed it must be said... throughout all of the episodes I have listened to, many hours of interviews, I have never heard a single person say “and then we prayed and asked God what to do” Romans 3:23

As a follower of Christ I appreciate this podcast because people need to have their stories heard enough with shutting down these voices because we want to protect the pastor but no one protects the ones they are supposed to lead. We need to heal and we need to stop these things from continuing to happen we need to follow the qualifications that are required of a pastor.

I’m glad this podcast exists to give voice to stories that need to be told. For the 1 star reviewers who don’t like it, maybe you should be a bit more concerned that there are stories like this coming out of so many churches, and less concerned with how it might make the church look bad. Yes we all know “not all churches”! 🙄 But it’s fair to say “most churches,” and people should know that. Too many new converts go into church all starry eyed and are the perfect naive targets for the kinds of abused talked about here.

I so appreciate this podcast’s desire and heart to bring the darkness to light, and to stand with victims as they tell the truth of their abuse. We cannot heal as the body of Christ without beginning to tell the truth and reckoning with the reality. What courage and needed justice. Grateful for bear witness, learn and advocate for better.

This podcasts holds the stories of survivors of church abuse and they do it with such tender care while also exposing what many churches are doing in the name of Christ but look nothing like him. This conversation is so important. Please start with the first two episodes. Please hear Johnna’s story and her heart behind this podcast. BBTB is a safe, soft landing place for the abused and discarded of the church.

Thank you for giving a voice to those who have experienced spiritual abuse! The validation I have felt while listening to these stories has been so needed!

I really love this podcast because it reveals the actual fruit of Acts29 churches. Many listened to the Rise and Fall of Mars Hill, myself included. What this podcast does is to show how the the abusive spiritual DNA from Mark Driscoll has carried into these Acts29 churches. How this tainted DNA has then gone on to harm so, so many Christians (or in Mars Hill parlance “giving units.”) Acts29 pastors learned “leadership” from Mark Driscoll and it sadly shows with all the stories in BBTB episodes. I highly recommend this podcast if you have any interest or have been a victim to spiritual abuse. You are not alone.

The host, who is clearly very young in her Christian faith, and her team have been beating this drum for years now. Has it made them less bitter? Do they provide hope for survivors beyond “burning down the church”? Has any survivor touched by them emerged healthier spiritually or emotionally? Any survivor who wants to put their abuse behind them will not be helped by this group. If you are new to this podcast, survivor, beware! They will use your story and your life for their own agenda and you will find yourself having to relive the most tragic events of your life over and over again.

It takes people like you to tell the truth of the dark and VERY REAL side of Church. As a family that started at Fellowship Church (Grapevine), we moved to The Village Church once Ed’s 2nd Private Jet story broke on local news. We were the 1st of our Home Team to leave. One by one, almost the entire Home Group left FC to TVC. I liked Matt, but never felt at Home. We thought we found a Church Home at Valley Creek. My heart would break when I learned that The Village Church and Valley Creek (BOTH SBC) took in Matt Tonne and his family WITHOUT A WORD TO THE CONGREGATION. Jason, with Valley Creek, was really nice and did his best to reassure me that we are safe! Things I heard, “We’re not like the Catholics. They have a real csa problem.” “We have eyes on him and he’s not allowed to go near children.” The ick factor was too real and my MOM RADAR told me to take my family and run. We did. This show validates what I knew, STAY AWAY FROM SBC! They only care about their image and YOUR MONEY!!!

I am disturbed and disappointed with these types of “deconstructing” your faith podcast. Gods WORD is TRUTH and we are ALL sinners in need of grace and mercy. Can the body of Christ do better? Of course but I’m tired of things that are CLEARLY called sin in Gods WORD now being being called “life style choices” or “born that way”. Stop excusing sinful behavior and making a god of your own choosing. That’s called an idol.

Having been very close to the situation described, the podcast shared a lot of false information. I tried to provide accurate information but they said it didn’t fit their narrative. Seems like they have a dangerous agenda rather than telling honest stories. Very disappointing.

A lot of these stories are one sided and are “alleged”. They don’t have complete facts and are spreading a lot of “here say”.

This podcast has been so eye opening and has helped me a lot. Thank you for sharing and being brave and being vulnerable with church hurt and harm.

First off: I believe that anyone who has been hurt by another individual or entity, such as a church, needs to tell his or her story and deserves a compassionate response and reparative action. I believe that the hosts of this podcast are well-intentioned in providing a platform for people to share their stories and a posture of listening empathically and reflectively. However, after having listened to several episodes including one about the church I have attended for 12 years, I have three significant concerns with how this podcast currently operates: First, the hosts seem to often contradict themselves on what it is they want. For example in Taylor’s story, they called the pastor’s actions “ridiculous” when he seemed be offering Taylor exactly what she had wanted earlier in the story, I.e. an audience with the critics within her church so that she could have a conversation with them. In Liz’s story, the hosts seemed to think the church was silly for not hiring Liz as a counselor on staff when she had no degree in counseling, but also seemed to advocate for best practices and quality of care in the church… I.e. perhaps having a licensed counselor doing the counseling. Second, the hosts pass considerable judgment on the alleged abusers in the way they engage their guests. The hosts believe absolutely every word their guests say and they meanwhile judge the actions of the church staff in the victims’ stories. Yet they have no further context on the stories, and place many assumptions on the staff members’ posture, attitude and intent in what the pastors or staff members did or said. The hosts speculate with abandon, as in Taylor’s story in which host Janna(sp?) says she thinks the pastor might have been fabricating a fake person to insult Taylor. Perhaps… but perhaps not! It is not the hosts’ place to make such speculations. This could land them in very deep water (slander) in cases where it is easier to identify the people in these stories and when the stakes might be higher. Another reviewer criticized an episode about a sexual assault case at camp in which one of the accused people had been acquitted…. This is exactly the hot water I presume the hosts do not want to be involved in: perpetuating potentially false claims with no chance for the other side of the conflict to speak or offer defense; they are not hearing the full story form their guests. Lastly, I’d like to mention that my church was featured here. The former church member who shared here on this podcast gave his/her individual story and opinion. Our church was easily identified where I live despite using anonymity in the podcast. I keep thinking about how much better, wholistic, nurturing, refreshing, helpful it would have been for the hurt member to handle this conflict/ hurt/ trauma with the people he or she was actually hurt by and thereby allow an opportunity for growth and healing. My advice to the hosts is: 1. Consider your deepest purpose in this podcast as it pertains to the Church. Is the Bride of Christ better off today than it was when you first began this podcast? Perhaps your guests are better off… but if that means several others were hurt in the process of those individuals being healed, was it ultimately good? If not, what could you change to make this podcast good for the Church? 2. Mind that your posture is not one of unquestioning judgment. You will never know the full stories of what you share here unless you operate as journalists and report on interviews you have conducted from multiple perspectives. At this point in time, it’s kind of the worst of both worlds in my opinion: hearing and empathizing with one side, judging and criticizing the silent side, and not doing anything to help heal this particular relationship or help educate this particular church. Furthermore, people who are already on the brink of turning away from the church will hear these stories and certainly turn away, in my opinion. 3. Remember that there are good yet flawed people running churches all around the nation and attending your podcast as guests. Most people on church staffs want to do well in their roles and would welcome constructive criticism. Our culture is one of extreme criticism and the expectation of absolute perfection. My friends, do not conform to this pattern. Thank you for reading.

So much for sharing the voices and hopefully there will be positive change within these organization.

Thank you. You’ve given us a place to process our spiritual abuse and continue to learn. I feel like I’ve reclaimed a piece of my voice. Thank you to each person at BBTB, each Storyteller, and each ATBS guest.

I’m grateful for the work being done here. These are important stories, and it means a lot to the survivors of this abuse to have a platform where they can share their experiences.

I actually went to church with one of the women sharing her story and this is the first time I’ve heard it from her perspective. I have since left that church and for good reason, as I had a similar experience with pastors harassing and meddling. I also really appreciated listening to Sarah’s story (Philadelphia). The hosts were spot-on about how the church treats single women like there is something wrong with us and that we have no purpose if we aren’t wives or mothers.

As you scroll through these reviews, you’ll see people giving 1 star because the “premise is good” but they don’t believe this is the way to do it. I’d love to ask these reviewers how to ethically tell stories of abuse, because they almost never get specific about it. this podcast is uncomfortable for people who affirm the machine that is White Evangelicalism. if you have an issue with people talking about how they have been hurt by the church (all while almost always keeping people anonymous), I wonder if you actually want to listen to stories of survivors. these stories are hard, messy, and show the need to wide spread change. J+J do a wonderful job with this holy work.

It’s important for survivors to be heard. It’s important for church leaders to listen and learn from other’s mistakes. This podcast is therapeutic.

Love the mix of peoples personal stories and educational type content.

An important podcast for any who have experienced church abuse or know someone who has, or who cares that those two words don’t belong together.

I’ve read the negative reviews after listening; and I think the people who are negatively criticizing this don’t understand the point of it; or perhaps have never undergone spiritual trauma themselves. One critic wrote “there’s two sides to every story,” indicating that perhaps victims are to blame for their own abuse; I find that incredibly shameful and toxic thinking. Of course no one is perfect; and there is no one without blemish or sin, even trauma victims. But that isn’t the point. If you’ve experienced spiritual abuse or any type of trauma within the “safe” walls of the church, these stories are validating. I think validation of others’ experience is a great place to start in the healing journey. Thank you to the creators.

A lot of good info

Thank you for your heart and kindness toward survivors of evangelicalism. A MUST LISTEN!

Courageous, Christ honoring, kind, bold, loving, important, and unwilling to mold to the fear Inflicting systems of toxic faith circles & churches. Thank you for the important work you are doing. Keep going even though some days are filled with criticism and pushback. Your show is so important & moving mountains even if the mountains feel unmovable ❤️

I think survivors need to be able to share their stories in a safe environment. This is not it. The hosts do not promote healing and their approach is unhealthy. Disappointed in this podcast.

This podcast does important work !

Some of the five star reviews assert that we who give one star reviews are part of the problem. Is it not possible that I can support a premise but reject the practice? Can you hear me say that victims of spiritual abuse matter; their stories need to be heard; but this podcast does not do that in a way that honors Christ or promotes the healing of the hurting? Like many of the other one-star reviews, I agree that the tone of the hosts is concerning, the false assumptions, the leading questions, the lack of pushback or attempt to ascertain facts make this podcast more harmful than helpful.

This podcast bravely shares the stories the rest of the church is too afraid to tell. The ones they try to silence. My faith has truly and slowly healed through hearing these stories, hearing from those willing to stand up for Justice, and through the discussions provoked by these thoughtful and poignant stories and conversations. Thank you for daring to speak. ❤️

Our family was never in an Acts 29 church but we were members of a number of churches where spiritual abuse took place. We spent 16 years in a Reformed Baptist Church. The story is too long to recount here. However, there are threads from the stories I’ve heard so far that mirror what we went through. Looking back there were red flags we should have paid more attention to and acted on: -The pastor bad mouthing people, from the pulpit, who left the church -Pastor’s wife taking me out to coffee and telling me to stay away from a certain couple who were asked to leave because “they were dangerous” -Pastor bad mouthing all the other churches in the valley because they didn’t do worship right and making us think ours was the only good church around -Deacon’s wife pointing out how humble the pastor is as he walks by with a smirk on his face -Pastor was never voted on by the congregation. He had said he would look for candidates for pastor. Suddenly one Sunday the deacon’s wife is telling the ladies how wonderful it was he was going to be our pastor and no need to go through a pastor search process. -God’s anger was preached more than His love. We always felt beat down -No service opportunities were allowed because people might get proud -Church leadership was to be trusted with everything and questions, concerns and suggestions were not welcome -We were expected to come back to church, be quiet and just avoid our abuser who was a church member. We couldn’t do that. He nearly tore our family apart. Later, we learned from the news he was involved in some shady stuff and the FBI was looking into it. Our son has had mental health issues from PTSD from this incident. Then we went to the next church and he was abused there by another church member and the pastor, compounding his mental health problems. These stories make me cry as I identify with aspects of each one. One thing I disagree with though is how complementarianism is thrown under the bus. The Bible is clear on who can be a pastor, elder or deacon. But there are plenty of places women can serve in the church and not be thought of as less than. The problem is these power hungry pastors and men who want to ruin it and keep women in the nursery, at home and out of the way. These people are the ones who give a black eye to complementarianism. We need to be Biblical and not throw the baby out with the bath water by swinging the pendulum too far to the other side.

I feel pretty confident that I would be considered among the target audience for this podcast, and honestly really want to cheer on this type of content. I commend the hosts for taking on such a difficult issue and creating a space to share stories. But I do say “proceed with caution” to listeners, and also to the hosts. I am leaving a review in hopes that it can only help make this podcast better in the end. The hosts bring their own stories and experiences of spiritual abuse to the table. It seems like there is a consistent commitment to approaching the conversations with humble and good intentions. I think because spiritual abuse is a personal experience for the hosts as well, that these are meant to be two-way conversations. They aren’t meant to be therapy sessions and both hosts regularly say they are not experts but fellow victims. But this is where it goes off the rails for me. So far, these episodes do not feel like a two-way conversation. And the hosts do take authoritative and opinionated stances often, despite claiming opposite intentions. I think Jonna and Jay have a lot of compassion and wisdom to offer for sure. BUT they are way too quick to interject, ask leading questions, and hijack the narrative a lot of the time. I feel like they are asking guests to share very difficult, private, and ongoing struggles and that better listening should be non-negotiable when navigating such difficult subject matter. Also non-negotiable: do not play the role of a professional or therapist when you are not one. The line seems blurry at times. So, this “proceed with caution” is for potential listeners as well as the hosts. If you are on your own healing journey, you might find this format to be a mix of helpful and hurtful. I find it can be really affirming at times, but also triggering. I have years of work and progress and wins that I can point to as I have navigated my own emotional abuse, but I can say that it is still very easy to experience setbacks when others are quick to tell you what to think and feel. There is way too much of that happening on this podcast.

It is unfortunate that while these stories are some version of the truth, a listener would never know because they don’t seek out the full truth.

While I strongly believe in the importance of providing a platform for victims to share their very real and painful stories of abuse within the Church - and have experienced some of that myself -the tone of the hosts strikes me as off-putting. Almost gleeful? Goading the guests on, even sometimes putting words in their mouths? I don’t know. I appreciate hearing the stories, but the hosts make me incredibly uncomfortable.

This podcast is incredibly well done. They are diligent and faithful in their work and the stories they bring us expose the great harm within toxic church spaces. I highly recommend this to people who want to understand what is happening and how we got here.

Have you ever wanted sit for an hour and listen to people tell a biased and one-sided version of a story while the hosts just wholesale stamp approval and agreement without trying to add nuance or push back? Then this podcast is for you! Someone else left a review that it’s church gossip porn. And that about hits the nail on the head. If you have legitimate trauma (which man that word is flung around without any standard of definition), then see a counselor, join a support group, actually pursue healing. This podcast is a place to make villains out of anyone you feel hurt by or don’t agree with your theological or philosophical viewpoints.

I just listed to your podcast and I am thankful someone is taking the time to tell these stories. They are painful and hard to hear but very needed so we can recognize abuse in church for what it is and confront it. My husband and I have our own personal experience with church abuse and listening to others stories helps me process my own story and heal.

This podcast shared stories of people that have been hurt in the church. It reveals how many churches have put programs, systems, and growth goals ahead of caring for the flock they have. The hosts show compassion and grace and are not out to hurt anyone but point out the way the church has become dysfunctional in so many places.

How diligent are you in gathering facts and opinions from all sides? It seems like you are giving a platform for one person with a grievance to speak out. In such a public forum you run the risk of broadcasting to the world opinions that are not necessarily supported by facts. And while guests may be sincere, are they giving a full and balanced portrayal of events. Typically we only see from our perspective. I encourage you to speak to all parties involved before broadcasting. Your shows may be less titillating but will reduce the risk of creating greater hurt and disunity in the Church.

As I have listened over the first year, you guys have improved at telling stories, but, more than that, I am really loving how you affirm your story-tellers. You are with them in their pain, and you reflect what is true and good about them—to them, in the midst of their retelling some very terrible events and associated trauma. Thank you for the work you are doing.

After listening to The Rise and Fall of Mars Hills, I’m so thankful someone is telling survivor stories. Hearing about the devastation from even one church abusing congregants is so dark, and this podcast sheds light on the people who have been impacted by these churches. Very positive, encouraging, and lifting up of those who have been hurt. I appreciate the care the hosts take with those sharing their stories.

We need spaces like the one BBTB creates to give people agency and an opportunity to tell their stories. This is a courageous venture by the hosts and they do their best to help those who come on as guests. My great concern is that this is just a space for outrage without productive action. I would love more podcast episodes that also feature content to help, how to become trauma informed, constructive conversations with pastors who embrace humility. Not just a repetitive cycle of anger and frustration. What is the better way? And how can you help us all see what it means to get there? Bc outrage will not be the steady road we can take for long.

Bodies Behind The Bus has been one of my top podcasts to listen to this past year. I wholeheartedly support any effort to center survivor stories and help them in their healing journey. The NDA episode with Robert Callahan was especially informative and helpful. Thank you to everybody on this team who sacrifice so much to help bring healing to the survivor community.

I see a lot of people claiming to be “Biblical” who are offended by this podcast. I would ask those people to do some serious self-reflection and ask themselves why they’re so offended by people exposing deeds of darkness.